The Glory of "Cheap" Epi (and Squier) Guitars

[epi 'sildo]

the op is right. gear has come a long way. i worked in a music store selling and and fixing guitars after the sea urchin diving went belly up here in 2000. i hate to admit it but i was a bit of a fender snob even though i liked some squiers. i wouldn't consider anything below an epi les paul standard and even then...well all this time later i wont part with my epi lp standard. and the other day a buddy of mine who is a real cheap guitar fan got an epi lp junior. i was blown away by just how good it was. and i had played them before. but when i worked at that store i was totally biased to the point of wearing blinders. that same buddy of mine has an aria strat thats just great. there's a lot of stuff out of china/asia now that is pretty damn good and i dont mean just for the money. the only thing i'd buy now from north american production is a godin. the squiers (classic vibes at least) have the mexican fenders blown out of the water. and i wouldn't even consider a gibson as long as there is an epi. to think i used to look down at them....

 

[AJ6stringsting]

Yes, I have heard it described so.

I've heard too about the supposed advantage. Perhaps it is so. But Gibson, in trying to resolved this "problem" (more a matter of guitar shape -- the body on some models being thinner than the downward deflection of the headstock -- then an actual "weakness" in the wood) chose to do so by means of a "volute" as seen here in my 1980 ES-Artist. -An approach that Martin has used for years.

View attachment 3505​

It may be that Gibson did not take the scarf joint approach despite it being superior for aesthetic reasons. Who can say? I do know that it looks kind of 'cheap' to me. But whatever the case it is what it is. And save wood it certainly does.



-don

My 1971 Gibson Medallion Series Flying V and 1974 Gibson Les Paul Custom have the "valute" .
I have had ex girlfriends knock them over in anger or the classic bar fight thing almost make it a casualty and that "valute" was sure a life saver. I hope Epiphone and Gibson bring back that feature to their necks.

 

[wildeman]

Bring back the Balut ,Gib/Epi!

 

[Lespaulman]

Like any brand, you will have great ones and duds. I have been very lucky to find Epi's that have good bones, and all I have to do is getting proper set ups done, and they are ready to go. last month, the gibson tour bus was at my local guitar store and I went to try out the 2017 line up, playing thru a EVH 5153 and everyone was complementing the sound. I grabbed a Epi LPC Pro, and boom, I didn't notice any major difference (gibson LP standard was perhaps a bit brighter due to the maple cap) but that's it. got a couple of comments saying that they did not expect the Epi to sound as good....

 

[TeleRooo]

My first guitar, back in the early 60's also, was an Stella acoustic. The action was so high I don't think even SRV would have liked it. But I spent my hours "In My Room", as Brian wrote, playing that thing until my finger calluses and hand strength was unbelievable. Man back then you really had to want to play to get through that. My next was a German made Hoyer 12 string. In the late 60's early 70's or so when the Takamine acoustics first showed up with pretty fair action and fair sound quality I thought, man the new kids taking up guitar have learning to play so much easier. Your basic cowboy chords were easy to play and sounded pretty good right off the bat. Much more motivating.

 

[Robert S]

This is absolutely true I agree 100% even though I am not that old I do have an appreciation for value and my standard squier and plus top pro are all the guitar I need like you said when they are set up there is no compromise

 

[Cam.man67]

I concur with this sentiment. When I was growing up (early '00s), the local musicians I was around all poo-pooed cheap guitars as junk...it took me until adulthood to realize how GOOD a lot of these guitars are. I haven't spent more than $300 on a guitar in YEARS. My Dot Studio is easily my #1, I wonder was "young snob" me would think about that.

 

[Robert S]

I prefer inexpensive not cheap but I really like the way one fella put it on here "just doesn't have the fancy trim package" With taxes my ptp would be $813 Canadian so not cheap but allot less expensive then a Gibson that gives you a tiny bit more eye candy and not much more because the ptps now look fantastic.

 

[BGood]

ptps ?
Come on guys, what is it with acronyms everywhere. Is it so hard to type a few words ? One time out of two, I have to look up what it means.

 

[Biddlin]

ptps ?

+1 What's with all the obscure and ambiguous acronyms?

 

[ikeus]

the op is right. gear has come a long way. i worked in a music store selling and and fixing guitars after the sea urchin diving went belly up here in 2000. i hate to admit it but i was a bit of a fender snob even though i liked some squiers. i wouldn't consider anything below an epi les paul standard and even then...well all this time later i wont part with my epi lp standard. and the other day a buddy of mine who is a real cheap guitar fan got an epi lp junior. i was blown away by just how good it was. and i had played them before. but when i worked at that store i was totally biased to the point of wearing blinders. that same buddy of mine has an aria strat thats just great. there's a lot of stuff out of china/asia now that is pretty damn good and i dont mean just for the money. the only thing i'd buy now from north american production is a godin. the squiers (classic vibes at least) have the mexican fenders blown out of the water. and i wouldn't even consider a gibson as long as there is an epi. to think i used to look down at them....

 

[ikeus]

My most costly is $1000.00 but, I like to mod and improve.. China strat clones @$44.00
up grading pick ups, tuners..etc.
Squires, I've modded up to deluxe and Vibes. Epi's; my Studieo has Bibsby, Vibramate, and Burst Buckers, coil splitting. My special has Di Marzio 36 th PAF's and Resomax bridge.
These all now sound super!

 

[ikeus]

Sorry: this didn't post.. tooo many words

 

[AJ6stringsting]

I got Squires and Epiphone guitars that are as good as my Fenders and Gibsons.
Back in 1986, my Marshall JCM 800 died and was sent into the shop for repairs, I got a Carvin X-100 B because my band had gigs lined up, that amp blew away the Marshall by a long shot.
Gear snobs always blow me away with their ignorance and prejudice against lower priced instruments, amps and accessories that are superior to high price gear.

 

[Scootermuppet]

ptps ?
Come on guys, what is it with acronyms everywhere. Is it so hard to type a few words ? One time out of two, I have to look up what it means.

Same here... Guess it's my lack of forum experience... or just my age!

How about a sticky post with a list of forum specific (I.e. Guitar based) acronyms?

Just a thought ...

 

[Scootermuppet]

On the subject of Far Eastern made instruments, I'll admit I was a little wary at first, but having had a few Korean made examples through my hands, I am hooked!

They seem well put together, play well and just seem 'solid', and for a while I specifically sought them out - but after falling in love with my Epi Tribute + (yes, I'm shallow - the faded burst and the flamed top wove their magic ) and buying her, I was also blown away at the attention to detail on this Chinese made guitar. (Epi's Quingdao factory, I believe?)

I know they were / are one of the higher end Epi's and as such might have been more 'under the microscope' from a quality angle, but it really is a very well built instrument.

Guitars from Indonesia are another example, I confess to having been a little wary, but a recent video made me think again...



Even Mr Chapman himself admits they are almost as good as his high end range!

It would seem the days of 'iffy' guitars are over, I believe nowadays it's a case of being able to get a reasonable quality & playable guitar whatever your budget... but I'd always recommend budgeting in for a set up - just to get it playing at its best.

Or why not get a 2nd hand basic model and start learning the set up process yourself? Saves some money, and gives you the satisfaction of knowing you did it

I still can't resist a sub £50 guitar that needs a little work, it's how I've made enough to upgrade and buy more expensive guitars - plus trading up is a lot of fun, and you get to play all sorts of interesting guitars too!

Only downside (for me) is I don't have space for more than half a dozen guitars - so it's getting harder to decide which six to keep when I get a bargain come along! Nice problem to have tho I guess

 

[duceditor]

Its rather fun to see a thought that once would have been seen as shocking now becoming accepted for what it is: simple truth. No longer are inexpensive guitars "cheap" guitars.

Over on the Squier-Talk forum there are several threads singing the endless praises of Epi "Special 1" with P90s. The TV Yellow version of which is almost reaching cut level. And more shocking still: It deserves it.

Of ALL my guitars past and present (currently about two-dozen, some as old as the `60s) the very best of them is a modern D'Angelico EXL-1, Its neck, it feel, its sound, it finish, its detailing. All are a league above. And my most played guitars is a Squier -- a VM Jaguar -- and one of those TV Yellow Spi Specials.

These are glorious instruments -- each in its own way. One for its fineness, the other for shear simple perfection, with no gloss at all.

-don

 

[Raiyn]

The best part of Epi and Squire guitars, especially the midrange stuff, is once you mod them and set them up how you like they can rival guitars from the flagship company.

In a lot of ways I feel it's better to "roll your own" you get more of a bond with something you've put blood sweat and tears into.

My 2¢

 

[duceditor]

The best part of Epi and Squire guitars, especially the midrange stuff, is once you mod them and set them up how you like they can rival guitars from the flagship company.

In a lot of ways I feel it's better to "roll your own" you get more of a bond with something you've put blood sweat and tears into.

My 2¢

So many would agree with you. I know on the Squier forum modding is IT. To some the principle attraction -- more even than making music.

I have to admit to not being among that group. If frets are a bit sharp I'll take them down, and in the case of my wtwo super inexpensive Epis -- a Junior and a Special -- I changed the tuning machines. But for me that's it.

Thus my amazement that these guitars are truly among my favorite players. And playing is to me what guitars are all about (and have been for some good many years! see The Abstracts: Hey, Let´s Go Now!)

-don

 

[Raiyn]

Ain't it great we can have similar, but slightly different views?